Members- NCCC is evaluating whether to spend $250 for a Club Account with RideWithGPS, where your ride leaders currently map out all our rides and make them available to y'all. The primary extra that members get with this account is that you get some extra Premium features on Club Routes with the RWGPS (Ride With GPS) app on your iPhone or Android phone. If you are not a paid member of RWGPS ($50/yr for Basic and $80/yr for Premium), then you are probably completely unaware of some pretty cool features, which allow you to use your phone and bypass spending ~$400 for a Garmin with turn-by-turn navigation. The primary features that I find really useful are:
- Download routes to phone. You can download both the cuesheet AND the relevant map data prior to the ride - cheap when you're at home with a wifi connection. Then, you can use the offline copy on your phone to navigate during the ride, with audio turn-by-turn navigation. Since the map data is on the phone, you can ride with cellular data OFF with full app maps and features, saving you both data expenses and battery life. Your phone should never drain the battery with this feature. If you've tried either the RWGPS or Strava apps on your phone, you'll know the frustration of a dead battery, and possibly extra data charges, when connected all the time to the cellular network. With the offline maps on your phone, you only need to make sure that your GPS location is ON.
- The voice navigation is really cool. It mirrors EXACTLY what the ride leaders put on the cue sheets, unlike the Garmin navigation. Even "stop here for a water break." I find the audio cues even better than what I have in much more expensive car navigation systems
To see how this works, check out this 3 minute video (http://ridewithgps.com/help/club-member-benefits/) from RWGPS.
Many people want to keep their phone in their jersey pocket or saddle bag - I do. You can still hear the voice directions (even better with one earbud if you ever use one - two are illegal :) ). And, for just $80, there is a bluetooth display gadget that boldly shows your RWGPS app data on a light, thin screen on your stem or handlebar so that you can put your phone away with the screen off to save more battery. Click here (http://ridewithgps.com/help/rflkt) for a short video on that.
To check this out on your own, install the RWGPS app on your phone at the iTunes Store (iPhone) or Play Store (Android) and then join our trial NCCC Club at http://ridewithgps.com/clubs/381-nccc (http://ridewithgps.com/clubs/381-nccc). Click on the button to join or send an email to rudnick.cooper@gmail.com for me to hook you in automatically. Then on your phone, login to the RWGPS app. If you already have that app installed, you should logout and log back in, so that your RWGPS account will pair you up with the NCCC trial Club Account. Then, on the left-hand side of the menu, you'll see Club Routes as in the screenshot of my phone below. Click on that. Any route you select will be available offline (arrow on bottom right hand side of the screen) as in the video and you're off and running without cellular data after you download and start navigating by voice. Other goodies are available such as "pinning" routes; for example, you can pin the rides you want for the next month and they will show up under "Pinned" - see the screenshot - where you only have a few rides to scroll through as we would eventually have many hundreds of rides total under Club Routes, which would be awkward to flip through them all.
I'm hoping a bunch of you try this out and provide feedback. If there is little interest we will NOT sign up for this Club Account, as the other features are either redundant or not as useful as our web pages. Please voice your opinion as this will be an agenda item for the March 24 NCCC Board meeting, after which the trial period expires. If you have put off spending $$$ on a Garmin computer and you have a smartphone, this gives you the same (arguably better) features of forking out for a Garmin. So, think about it... If you've already spent the big bucks on a Garmin or similar, I apologize if you're now having a little buyer's remorse :'(
Just to be clear. If we go for the Club Account, nothing will change on the website or how we plan and post our rides. The only function of the Club Account I would recommend using for now is members' use of the RWGPS app's Premium features on Club Routes only. We don't want to change that.
-Karl
I just got a caution from RWGPS support on the cool Wahoo RFLKT bluetooth display that mates with the RWGS app. It evidently works great with iPhones, but there may be kinks with Android. I'm sure they will get straightened out, but I don't want to misinform anyone. BTW, I ordered one to try out with my Android phone. If it doesn't work I'll return it via Amazon. Stay tuned - I get it on Monday.
A little off topic, but on the subject of downloadable maps, Nokia's free HERE maps, together with RidewithGPS and a GPX viewer, have worked for me (when I use them :) ). I gather they can provide turn by turn guidance, haven't tried that:
https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/here-maps-offline-navigation/id955837609?mt=8&ign-mpt=uo%3D4
http://www.cio.com/article/2896304/mobile-apps/5-things-youll-love-about-nokia-here-maps-app-for-ios-and-3-you-wont.html
Nice to know that there are other apps that provide offline maps to save data and bandwidth. That review says that pedestrians, though, don't get the voice cues, only drivers. I'm guessing, that if you ride your bike faster than you walk 8), then you will get those voice cues on your bike.
Thanks for the reference
I have a Garmin and a SmartPhone, and the ridewithgps and strava apps. When I tried the apps with my cheap droid they drained the battery too fast to last an entire ride. This was over a year ago, and I haven't tried with my iPhone, so maybe the app has improved in that regard. Anyway, that's something to consider and test on your own phone. Its the main reason I continue use a Garmin for tracking rides and navigation.
Jim - The whole point of the Premium offline map download feature is to remove battery drain, especially if you turn off your cellular data, leaving only your phone's location services on. As a paid member, I can attest to that. Just join the trial club and verify for yourself with either phone, even if you're a non-paid RWGPS member. The Strava app is a different story, but cell data off/gps on helps there, also. I, like you, don't like the battery drain for either the RWGPS or Strava apps when running in a mode where data (especially big map data) is constantly being communicated back and forth. The voice navigation is really great as you don't need to use your eyes and you get all the cues that the ride leaders add by hand.
Karl
If anyone wants to just join the trial NCCC Club account, click here (https://ridewithgps.com/clubs/381-nccc?join_code=ZI7qa7WmfGgR0eXc). The Club Route Library contains this month's March Roadies rides, so that you can try out the Premium features of the RWGPS app on one of the rides if you like.
Karl
Also, the term "airplane mode" may be slightly different for different phones. Whatever kind of phone you have, for saving battery life, you want cellular data OFF but GPS location ON so that you can navigate and record. Some phones may turn GPS OFF for airplane mode. fyi my samsung galaxy s3 in airplane mode allows me to keep gps location services on - ymmv ;)
Quote from: karlos on March 04, 2016, 06:14:08 PM
I just got a caution from RWGPS support on the cool Wahoo RFLKT bluetooth display that mates with the RWGS app. It evidently works great with iPhones, but there may be kinks with Android. I'm sure they will get straightened out, but I don't want to misinform anyone. BTW, I ordered one to try out with my Android phone. If it doesn't work I'll return it via Amazon. Stay tuned - I get it on Monday.
Ok, I now have some firsthand info on the Wahoo RFLKT bluetooth display for keeping your phone in your pocket and displaying primary data on its stem or handlebar mount, including turning cues from the RWGPS app. We checked it out on the Wed Bonsall ride today. It worked great on the iPhone. On my android Samsung Galaxy S3, it would lose connection every 30 seconds or so. I contacted RWGPS and Wahoo support and the solution was to revert to a previous firmware version, while they work on fixing the issue. I did that and can confirm it also works well on android phones, too. As Wahoo continues to upgrade its firmware (hardware evidently is great), and RWGPS continues to improve the app, things will only get better. I still will probably use my Garmin out of habit, but I would definitely go this route for phone connectivity without battery drain and voice navigation if I didn't have a Garmin. I still may lay the Garmin aside because I really like the voice navigation better. I might add that we navigated in airplane mode on an iPhone and Android for 67 miles and 6700'+ elevation today, about 6 hrs total for the ride, and both phones experienced about 30% battery drain, just about the normal drain I get when I'm not running any apps.
For you Strava weenies, you save your ride when done on your RWGPS account, then download as a .gpx file and simply upload to Strava if that's where you prefer to log your rides.
Karl
Thank you for the report Karl. Sounds pretty cool. Do you know what the battery life is for the RFLKT unit? The website has info on the type of battery but not expected longevity.
-Robert
Wahoo claims 6-9 months battery life. I was checking out some forums and it could be 3-5 months. I wish they would give battery life in terms of hours ridden instead as it obviously depends on how much you ride . We'll see but at least it's not weekly or monthly. I like not having to plug it in all the time.
Interesting coincidence. If the Wahoo RFLKT is of interest, it is only $59.99 (25% off) through March 13 at http://www.wahoofitness.com/devices/wahoo-rflkt-iphone-powered-bike-computer.html
Also, you don't want to get the RFLKT+ as it has extra sensors that drain battery. Users say the RFLKT+ batteries last days as opposed to the RFLKT battery life on the order of months. Also the RWGPS app does not make use of the extra features of the RFLKT+ which is why they only talk about the basic RFLKT on the RWGPS website.
Karl
[disclaimer: I do NOT work for Wahoo, nor do I get kickbacks, and since I have a Garmin and a Premium RWGPS account anyway, I really don't need any of this stuff. This is just for NCCC member information :)]
I've downloaded the app. Waiting for group membership approval. One feature I'm keen to try is the live logging, to share my location with others (spouse mostly, or maybe other riders on a long ride).
The live logging requires constant cellular connection, though. It's a standard [wrong, it's now a paid (http://www.northcountycycleclub.com/smf/index.php?topic=2109.msg5276#msg5276)] feature of the app and is contrary to using the premium feature of keeping the route and map offline with cellular data off. But it's a nice feature if you want keep your ride recording live.
Correction. Live logging is no longer an unpaid feature of the app. The Club Account does not upgrade your RWGPS membership to a Premium membership, but only gives you some paid Premium features like voice navigation and map tile downloading for offline use on Club Routes ONLY. Live logging was originally free and since I've had a paid membership for a couple years, live logging has always been enabled when I use the app, although I've only used it a few times and never thought of sharing it live with my wife or riding friends, and not sure how well that would work for precise location. I'll be interested in your success with live logging, Jim. It was not specifically listed as one of the member benefits of the club account. (http://ridewithgps.com/help/club-member-benefits/)
Jim Robinson's comment about live logging made me realize that some clarification between non-paid and paid members is required. Please see this RideWithGPS chart (https://ridewithgps.com/help/compare-plans) comparing the features for the different levels of membership. The Club Account gives you some, but not all, Premium features for the app and it only applies to routes in the Club's Route Library. These features are: (1) Turn-by-turn Navigation for iPhone and Android; (2) Offline Maps for iPhone and Android. The other paid features you get apply when you are accessing your RideWithGPS account through the web interface: (1) Estimated Time; (2) Advanced Turn Notifications (set different distance than default 30m) for TCX route download; (3) Print Custom Maps and Cue Sheets (these are quite nice, but require full page(s) of paper as opposed to the compressed narrow slips your route leaders create by hand for you).
Basically, the paid features you get are things that are applicable to our Club Routes. Things like live logging are applicable to just riding - even if you're on a Club Route, you may depart it in the middle of the ride (maybe even for 100 miles :) ) and then it makes sense that live logging would not apply.
I apologize if there's any confusion. I still think the Club Account is providing a benefit to NCCC members at only about $1/member - please let your voice be heard on what YOU think (http://www.northcountycycleclub.com/smf/index.php?topic=2111.0).
Just a thought regarding the RFLKT - many people use the little top tube mounted bags, so it seems that if a smart phone could fit, there should be no issues with tranmission to the RFLKT unit from the smart phone.
-Robert
Robert - blue tooth has no issues for me wherever I have my phone with the testing I've done so far. I keep it in my back jersey pocket. I think when this device first came out, there were issues with signal blocking. I haven't experienced that. This weekend's rides will be the first time I keep the RFLKT on for 4+ hr rides and will see if there is any loss of connectivity. Bluetooth can be finnicky, but it's working fine for me on my android phone.
Karl
Jim:
Re: Sharing ride status withe SO...
GLYMPSE App offers this feature. Available Android or iPhone.
Lou...
Hey, Jim
I wanted to alert you to the fact that group live logging (https://ridewithgps.com/help/group-live-logging) has been available to all Club members since May 1 (I missed that announcement). See this post https://ridewithgps.com/help/whats-new-in-clubs and scroll down to May 1, 2016. I still haven't tried it yet and observed effect on battery life. You can somewhat control battery drain by setting your live logging interval to be more sparse. I would also like to compare phone battery use when paired with a Garmin Edge 820. It also has live tracking features of multiple riders and is probably less cumbersome since it doesn't require "Group" or "Club" membership, although there may be some Garmin Connect things you need to tweak. See this video on 820 live tracking (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FaLkTXtG_Z4).
My question is what enables a individual to be tracked by the 2 different applications. .In the Garmin case anyone in a group running Garmin connect on there cell phone would be able to be tracked. Then of course for those with a 820 you would have a heads up display. As well as RWGPS everyone in the group would have to be running that app on there cell phone to be tracked.
More info on the 820
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xvWVxs6oOJU
Just more clarifications on Group Live Logging for our Club Account. All it does is that the Club association is just like the Group association. So, instead of having to join some Group, which may not even exist, all Club members will automatically see each other when Live Logging. An interesting feature of that is that all our groups, Cruisers, Regular, Long would be visible at the same time so that when our rides intersected or got close to each other, it could look messy ;). You can figure out who is who by blowing up the screen and clicking on their icon, but not something to do while riding - there's enough distracted driving out there already!
But remember, Live Logging is a feature available only to paid RWGPS accounts, $50/yr for Basic (all you really need) and $80/yr for Premium. See Compare Plans (https://ridewithgps.com/help/compare-plans) for the differences in features.
But, after watching Nigel's videos on the 820, if I were getting a new Garmin today, the 820 would be the one for me.